Banking. Again!

[Merlin]

Yesterday was a pain in the arse.

My wife and step-daughter were leaving last night to enrol jnr. at Chulalongkorn University today. I wanted some extra cash for them and decided to use an HSBC Debit Card at my branch of Bangkok Bank in Robinsons. I rarely use the ATM machine due to the 220THB charge (plus the overseas transaction charge, plus the lousy exchange rate.) After going through the palaver of handing over my card, my pink I.D. card, and my UK Passport for copying and countersigning - the passport being a new requirement to allow the transaction to be authorised - WTF - I entered my pin number incorrectly. I tried again, making sure the number was typed correctly. Nope - refused. They said the card was declined by my bank. Really?

I drove home and phoned HSBC (the battery on my mobile was at 1%) The spotty oik at the other end thought he was talking to a 5 year old. He said that there was nothing wrong with my card. His system showed that one incorrect number had been attempted, and confirmed that we have THREE attempts to get it right. My card had not been locked, blocked, or otherwise manipulated by HSBC and that there were adequate funds in the account. He said I should go back to Robinsons branch of BKK Bank. Step daughter said "use the one in Big C or elsewhere in Surin." Having tried that before, without any joy, I reluctantly decided to use an ATM as time was running out. Then, I remembered that I'd wanted to put some cash in my Bkk Bank account anyway, so went to Big C. The teller there apologised and said that they don't have a debit card machine at the counter (just the external ATM) Apparently, Bkk Bank only allow two branches in Surin with the appropriate device. I used the ATM instead. Back into the branch to deposit the cash... It took an hour and a half to complete the process from start to finish.

This, or similar, has happened on a few occasions, and, when the branch is queuing to the door and I can't be bothered waiting an hour for my turn, I use the ATM outside. If it is a weekend near the end of the month, and the machine might be running low on cash, the damn thing gives priority to Thai bank cards, and refuses to deliver cash to us mortals.

I relate this because of the tendency, worldwide now, for banks to prefer electronic transactions over cash, claiming that printing/minting/processing cash is expensive, as is maintaining/filling/repairing ATM machines. So we are to be encouraged, in future, to use our smartphones to pay for everything.

Has no-one told these bankers that Thai shops/restaurants/service stations rarely accept anything else except cash? And the same applies in some other countries too as I read here: https://www.cnbc.com/advertorial/20...hilippines.html?__source=taboola|globe|msn-uk

So many people are unable to open banking facilities in the Philippines (only 23% of adults have accounts!) that putting an electronic system in place disenfranchises a whole bunch of most businesses' customers! The march towards a cashless society, (engineered that way by the banks in the banks' interests and NOT their customers') is unlikely to be stopped, but relying on an electronic facility as I once did (but only once) late one Sunday night in Bangkok to fill the car with sufficient fuel to drive back to Surin only to find that the Thai ATM system wasn't playing ball (according to HSBC who said that there was no record on their system of any ATM card activity on my account that day) demonstrates the perils of attempting electronic transactions.

What's the solution - apart from carrying far too much money for comfort in my wallet or at home?

 

[FERET]

Yesterday was a pain in the arse.

My wife and step-daughter were leaving last night to enrol jnr. at Chulalongkorn University today. I wanted some extra cash for them and decided to use an HSBC Debit Card at my branch of Bangkok Bank in Robinsons. I rarely use the ATM machine due to the 220THB charge (plus the overseas transaction charge, plus the lousy exchange rate.) After going through the palaver of handing over my card, my pink I.D. card, and my UK Passport for copying and countersigning - the passport being a new requirement to allow the transaction to be authorised - WTF - I entered my pin number incorrectly. I tried again, making sure the number was typed correctly. Nope - refused. They said the card was declined by my bank. Really?

I drove home and phoned HSBC (the battery on my mobile was at 1%) The spotty oik at the other end thought he was talking to a 5 year old. He said that there was nothing wrong with my card. His system showed that one incorrect number had been attempted, and confirmed that we have THREE attempts to get it right. My card had not been locked, blocked, or otherwise manipulated by HSBC and that there were adequate funds in the account. He said I should go back to Robinsons branch of BKK Bank. Step daughter said "use the one in Big C or elsewhere in Surin." Having tried that before, without any joy, I reluctantly decided to use an ATM as time was running out. Then, I remembered that I'd wanted to put some cash in my Bkk Bank account anyway, so went to Big C. The teller there apologised and said that they don't have a debit card machine at the counter (just the external ATM) Apparently, Bkk Bank only allow two branches in Surin with the appropriate device. I used the ATM instead. Back into the branch to deposit the cash... It took an hour and a half to complete the process from start to finish.

This, or similar, has happened on a few occasions, and, when the branch is queuing to the door and I can't be bothered waiting an hour for my turn, I use the ATM outside. If it is a weekend near the end of the month, and the machine might be running low on cash, the damn thing gives priority to Thai bank cards, and refuses to deliver cash to us mortals.

I relate this because of the tendency, worldwide now, for banks to prefer electronic transactions over cash, claiming that printing/minting/processing cash is expensive, as is maintaining/filling/repairing ATM machines. So we are to be encouraged, in future, to use our smartphones to pay for everything.

Has no-one told these bankers that Thai shops/restaurants/service stations rarely accept anything else except cash? And the same applies in some other countries too as I read here: https://www.cnbc.com/advertorial/2018/11/26/fintech-in-the-philippines.html?__source=taboola|globe|msn-uk

So many people are unable to open banking facilities in the Philippines (only 23% of adults have accounts!) that putting an electronic system in place disenfranchises a whole bunch of most businesses' customers! The march towards a cashless society, (engineered that way by the banks in the banks' interests and NOT their customers') is unlikely to be stopped, but relying on an electronic facility as I once did (but only once) late one Sunday night in Bangkok to fill the car with sufficient fuel to drive back to Surin only to find that the Thai ATM system wasn't playing ball (according to HSBC who said that there was no record on their system of any ATM card activity on my account that day) demonstrates the perils of attempting electronic transactions.

What's the solution - apart from carrying far too much money for comfort in my wallet or at home?

Unfortunately mate, it is a fact of life here that most financial institutions are nothing more than rectal pollups.
I transfereed $00,000 from Aus a few weeks ago and, my bank in Aus only charged me $30.00 AUD but the bushrangers @ SCB stung me 12,000 THB.
If the plan that my advisor has works I will share the info.

 

[Yorky]

I have a bank account in Thailand with ATM, debit card, Visa card, and shopping card access 24 hours/day (no charge). From by bank account in UK I am able to transfer up to £10,000.00 per transaction at a cost of £15.00 per transaction which will be deposited in Thailand within 24 hours. Piece o' pish.

 

[nomad97]

I trashed my UK debit and credit cards a long time ago and work on a cash basis. My income is derived solely from three pensions in the UK and I transfer what cash I need to Thailand with TransferWise at least once a month. I transfer in excess of 65,000 baht each month so that I will meet the criteria set out by Immigration to permit the yearly extension to stay based on retirement. My next extension is due the end of this year. For what it is worth, I bank with Bangkok Bank although I seldom use the bank's premises in Robinson's. I find the Big C or Tesco branches more user friendly and more convenient.

 

[Prakhonchai Nick]

Merlin's probelm was not transferring money from the UK to his account, but actually being able to access it.

I would suggest the purchase of a simple electronic safe (circa 1,000baht), bolt it to the floor in a discrete location, and keep a reasonable amount of cash inside. At least the pppppproblems encountered yesterday could be more easily overcome.

 

[Yorky]

Merlin's probelm was not transferring money from the UK to his account, but actually being able to access it.

I have no problem accessing my money. I keep sufficient in my Thai bank (in excess of Bht 800,000.00). If necessary I can top this up from UK funds. I don't see a problem.

 

[nomad97]

Merlin's probelm was not transferring money from the UK to his account, but actually being able to access it.

I would suggest the purchase of a simple electronic safe (circa 1,000 baht), bolt it to the floor in a discrete location, and keep a reasonable amount of cash inside. At least the pppppproblems encountered yesterday could be more easily overcome.

Keep it under the mattress like everyone else. Failing that, give it to your wife. She will keep it safe from all comers.

 

[nomad97]

Merlin's probelm was not transferring money from the UK to his account, but actually being able to access it.

I would suggest the purchase of a simple electronic safe (circa 1,000 baht), bolt it to the floor in a discrete location, and keep a reasonable amount of cash inside. At least the pppppproblems encountered yesterday could be more easily overcome.

Surely, the easiest way is to keep some money in your Thai bank account. Then, with your Thai ATM card you can withdraw money at a moment's notice from virtually any ATM machine scattered around town and without withdrawal fees (from participating banks).

 

[Wombat]

I trashed my UK debit and credit cards a long time ago and work on a cash basis. My income is derived solely from three pensions in the UK and I transfer what cash I need to Thailand with TransferWise at least once a month. I transfer in excess of 65,000 baht each month so that I will meet the criteria set out by Immigration to permit the yearly extension to stay based on retirement. My next extension is due the end of this year. For what it is worth, I bank with Bangkok Bank although I seldom use the bank's premises in Robinson's. I find the Big C or Tesco branches more user friendly and more convenient.

Nomad, how much do Transferwise charge you each monthly transfer? What system on TW do you use, I have heard you mention Borderless Banking or similar. I am thinking of doing my retirement extension your way now. How many months in advance do you think I would need to start this method, my extension is due mid November.

 

[ColinW]

@Wombat - if you look at Transferwise's website you can change the currencies and amounts and it will show you the exchange rate and their charges.
When I send GBP to Transferwise from my UK account for the transaction and when Bangkok Bank here in Surin receive the baht there are no further charges.

 

[Wombat]

@ColinW - I use TW to do an annual transfer for my annual living expenses, I have just worked out that it only costs me about $40AU more to bring my money in monthly using TW and the upside is that it will meet Immigration's guidelines for my retirement extension.
I have used TW for my last 2 annual transfers and have found that they give a very good exchange rate. So, I can leave my money in an Oz high interest account and just draw on it monthly or, simply leave it in my Superannuation Income Stream and do a monthly withdrawal from it.

 

[Prakhonchai Nick]

@ColinW - I use TW to do an annual transfer for my annual living expenses, I have just worked out that it only costs me about $40AU more to bring my money in monthly using TW and the upside is that it will meet Immigration's guidelines for my retirement extension.
I have used TW for my last 2 annual transfers and have found that they give a very good exchange rate. So, I can leave my money in an Oz high interest account and just draw on it monthly or, simply leave it in my Superannuation Income Stream and do a monthly withdrawal from it.

Note that TW rate changes virtually every minute. I did a very large transfer yesterday for a widow. First thing in the morning the rate was just on 41baht/£ I did the deal around noon when the rate was 41.23, after which the rate slipped back down Currently about 40.90 Have to try and get in at the best rate of the day..pure luck though.

 

[nomad97]

Nomad, how much do Transferwise charge you each monthly transfer? What system on TW do you use, I have heard you mention Borderless Banking or similar. I am thinking of doing my retirement extension your way now. How many months in advance do you think I would need to start this method, my extension is due mid November.

I use a Borderless account. There is a facility on TransferWise that allows you to see how much each transfer would cost. For example, I will transfer some £2,000 per month, approximately 80,000 baht per month, for about £12.00 per transfer. There are no other charges, none at Bangkok Bank, and the exchange rate is always better than I could get any where else. Plus, I am kept informed about the transfer and when the money will be in my account in Thailand. From their website today:


See: https://transferwise.com/pricing/#pricing-page-calculator-anchor .

You asked about monthly transfers and when to start. Immigration has said they want 12 monthly transfers, i.e. 1 full year, but that they may make exceptions for the first year. Accordingly, I suggest you start these monthly transfers immediately.